Heavy Metal as a Lifestyle.

[VictimeDelExil]

For starters, excuse me if this belongs in an off-topic sub-forum.

There's one thing that often comes across my mind, especially now-a-days with the advent of "armchair metalheads" that I encounter both online and in real life. I'll elaborate further on what an "armchair metalhead" is.
You see, when I was younger, I remember I would often read online (showing how much younger I am than the average member here) that "music isn't a fashion, only posers dress metal" and other such crap from supposed "metalheads" online. When really, I believe it is quite the opposite. I think if you are truly passionate about Heavy Metal, you do not have short hair, you do not dress like everyone else, and you do not preach such politically correct bullshit as "you can dress however you want and listen to Metal!" - I think the way one dresses and acts separates the REAL hardrockers (I hate the term metalhead, I use this term instead thanks to Swedish friends) from those who are just "casual fans" of Metal.

Now of course, I also believe in individualism, so I think even if you are true hardrocker and dress 80s, you don't necessarily have to dress exactly the same as every other Muskelrock or Keep It True attendee, as that is also posing as well. Additionally, I do not think that all hardrockers have to act a certain way, drink beer, do drugs, or have some sort of belief system, as again I think part of the Heavy Metal lifestyle is again, being an individual.

But this brings me to "armchair metalheads", the type of idiot who doesn't have their own taste, and just copies whatever is "true metal" according to some "underground" celebrity like Fenriz (not trying to diss him, just those who copy him without having their own taste), or the latest fad webzine, acting like they've known about bands like Manilla Road for their entire life when in-reality they've only known about them since after Mark's untimely passing. These "armchair metalheads" just go with the general consensus when it comes to what is "true metal" or not, and revolve pretty much every aspect of their taste around online clique elitists. And ironically, many of these self-proclaimed "true metalheads" will cry about "gatekeeping" whenever they encounter someone with differing opinions to theirs.

Speaking again about the fashion, I truly believe that mainstream Thrash Metal bands that normalized dressing casually on-stage helped diminish the "cool" factor of Metal overall, with Metal fashion changing from spandex, bright leather jackets, and spiked-wristbands, to lame shit such as camo-shorts and t-shirts... which is pretty much unpleasing to people who aren't already into Metal. I don't really think young kids are going to see a band that dresses casually and go "wow those guys look cool, I want to listen to this music", but they would instead if they saw bands with interesting dress codes like Silver Mountain, Running Wild, Judas Priest, Kiss (don't like their music, but obviously many 70s kids were into them for this reason), Mentors, etc.

Hopefully this post makes sense, it's definitely some half-asleep half-awake rambling about some of my personal beliefs revolving the current state of the metal scene.

[mordred]

I don't think it makes much sense. It's a bit contradictionary, not to mention juvenile.

Look. I'm a dad. Always had short hair. I do love my arm chair, it's usually where I sit down to spin my records. I listened to Manilla Road before you were born. That's not impressive. I was born in 1982, so others listened to Manilla Road before I was born. You'd look down on those who did not know Manilla Road before Mark Shelton died, yet you were yourself a child when he died. Why would you distinguish when there's barely any difference? It's not a competition. The only reason anyone would pretend they have known Manilla Road longer than they have would be because of the false notion that it's a competition, and with your reasoning you're perpetuating such a notion.

I think you're missing the point: That your passion is your own to make the best of for yourself. Measuring it against others serves no purpose, so there is no need to evaluate what others do and how they do it.

Also, since you are quite obviously annoyed by a lot of others who share an interest in the same type of music that you do, you must also account for the possibility that others might be equally annoyed by you.

[Kraignoss666]

Guess it’s a pretty common feeling within genres we love. I come from the punk/hardcore scene, and there were the same reactions: who’s more punk than who? In my opinion, it leads nowhere. There are many motivations to get involved into metal, work, parentality… Categorizing may be dangerous: are my criteras more valuable than yours? Welcome philosophy!
I came to metal in my 30ies, as I didn’t have much occasions to meet the metal community when I was younger (pre internet times, in a french country side…). I don’t have long hair because my hair is too weird and I mostly feel I look like nothing when there are more than 10 cm (tastes are what they are). In the meanwhile, I don’t feel like I’m here for the wrong reasons, as I’m truly meeting this music with deep passion and love. As long as it means something to you (whatever it is), I think you’re at the right place.
Just my thoughts

[Warepire]

I've had more (half-)drunk attendees at festivals call me poser than I want to admit, because I really do not look like I'd attend such an event on purpose if you'd judge me based on appearance.

I also lived on the country side as a kid, HammerFall's Renegade was the first time I heard a metal song, before that I was into boybands because it was that kind of music that you'd hear normally. Took me a while to realize that HammerFall wasn't unique in the style.
As a result I entered a period where I would download everything, which eventually lead me to this place, among others.
I developed a rather wide style-wise interest through that, anything from pop rock to death metal usually appeals to me in some way. I am equally into Magnum and Bolt Thrower for example.
But I never joined the appearance part of rock or metal, nor the "stereo-typical" taste in movies, food and drinks.

To top it off I have a rather un-metal job in the field of software development.

I'm here because the 80s and early 90s produced some really good stuff, and here is a good place to find out about such things.

[mordred]

I've had more (half-)drunk attendees at festivals call me poser than I want to admit, because I really do not look like I'd attend such an event on purpose if you'd judge me based on appearance.

It’s ironic isn’t it, that you’d be called a poser for your lack of true metal props to, eh... pose with.

[VictimeDelExil]

I don't think it makes much sense. It's a bit contradictionary, not to mention juvenile.

Look. I'm a dad. Always had short hair. I do love my arm chair, it's usually where I sit down to spin my records. I listened to Manilla Road before you were born. That's not impressive. I was born in 1982, so others listened to Manilla Road before I was born. You'd look down on those who did not know Manilla Road before Mark Shelton died, yet you were yourself a child when he died. Why would you distinguish when there's barely any difference? It's not a competition. The only reason anyone would pretend they have known Manilla Road longer than they have would be because of the false notion that it's a competition, and with your reasoning you're perpetuating such a notion.

I think you're missing the point: That your passion is your own to make the best of for yourself. Measuring it against others serves no purpose, so there is no need to evaluate what others do and how they do it.

Also, since you are quite obviously annoyed by a lot of others who share an interest in the same type of music that you do, you must also account for the possibility that others might be equally annoyed by you.

I was expecting this exact type of reply. And no, I never meant to say it was a competition, I was just using it as an example, to rant about "metalheads" who just jump onto whatever is trendy within the "trve underground" sector of Metal... It's quite humorous to see you belittle me for my age, when that is besides my point - I was ranting about people who don't discover bands on their own and just get their taste from some sort of "tastemaker" webzine or quasi-celebrity. Sorry to hear you have short hair.

Should also add I am not trying to be "divisive" or anything like that; I'm just curious to hear everyone's opinions and perspective on this subject.

[Cochino]

For starters, excuse me if this belongs in an off-topic sub-forum.

...

With you being a younger guy, I can absolutely understand where you're coming from. I think we've all been what you've been through when we were younger and I think it is a necessary stage to go through to develop your own taste in music and even personality as a whole. It helps to develop a core that won't get modified when for different reasons you might want or maybe even have to start getting your hair cut, wearing more "normal" clothes, etc. I took the chance of the lockdowns to grow my hair long again but I had been cutting my hair rather short for a few years before, and I still mostly wear band shirts and jeans but never liked leather and I don't even hang out with metalheads anymore.

As time goes by, different people get into different situations that change certain aspects of their lifestyles, and I think that's why it's important to develop that core at an early age, so when those changes come along you still have that thing that turned you into a metalhead when you were younger. So, of course around here you'll find mostly older people that will find some of your statement silly, but in all honestly, we were all probably even sillier when we were about your age or younger. My only advice from being on the other side of things would be not to judge people themselves by those standards, because it's a waste of time and it's unfair to them. I know many a metalhead that I wouldn't even dare to call a poser, and they might even have good arguments to calle me one, but they're just shitty people that I don't wanna have anything to do with anyway. Being a "true" metalhead doesn't make you a good person, in the same way that not being one doesn't make you worthless. Try not to limit yourself to that outlook and just enjoy the music, and hang out with good people even if they listen to Greta Van Fleet or whatever.

And also, just as it's silly to think that you have to cut your hair and start dressing in one way 'cause your X years old and you're supposed to be an "adult", it's also silly by the same logic to force yourself to do the opposite just to remain "true". Just be honest and comfortable with yourself, and the rest will fall into place.

[VictimeDelExil]

For starters, excuse me if this belongs in an off-topic sub-forum.

...

With you being a younger guy, I can absolutely understand where you're coming from. I think we've all been what you've been through when we were younger and I think it is a necessary stage to go through to develop your own taste in music and even personality as a whole. It helps to develop a core that won't get modified when for different reasons you might want or maybe even have to start getting your hair cut, wearing more "normal" clothes, etc. I took the chance of the lockdowns to grow my hair long again but I had been cutting my hair rather short for a few years before, and I still mostly wear band shirts and jeans but never liked leather and I don't even hang out with metalheads anymore.

As time goes by, different people get into different situations that change certain aspects of their lifestyles, and I think that's why it's important to develop that core at an early age, so when those changes come along you still have that thing that turned you into a metalhead when you were younger. So, of course around here you'll find mostly older people that will find some of your statement silly, but in all honestly, we were all probably even sillier when we were about your age or younger. My only advice from being on the other side of things would be not to judge people themselves by those standards, because it's a waste of time and it's unfair to them. I know many a metalhead that I wouldn't even dare to call a poser, and they might even have good arguments to calle me one, but they're just shitty people that I don't wanna have anything to do with anyway. Being a "true" metalhead doesn't make you a good person, in the same way that not being one doesn't make you worthless. Try not to limit yourself to that outlook and just enjoy the music, and hang out with good people even if they listen to Greta Van Fleet or whatever.

And also, just as it's silly to think that you have to cut your hair and start dressing in one way 'cause your X years old and you're supposed to be an "adult", it's also silly by the same logic to force yourself to do the opposite just to remain "true". Just be honest and comfortable with yourself, and the rest will fall into place.

I actually quite agree with what you said. I will back-pedal a little bit and say that I do think it is excusable for older hardrockers (i.e. those who are 40+ and have a family to provide for) that need to look "presentable" for their career, but that's really the only exception. And as I said I do believe there is some individualism, regardless if you are a "true" metalhead or not. I mean my hair is classified as "long" but it's still slightly shorter than what they call shoulder length. This type of hairstyle is obviously not really "in" with the current metal crowd, as it's more something that would've been common in 1979-1982.

Also I was trying to rant about the PC-ness of the current generation of "metalheads" that I encounter, I just unfortunately didn't reflect on it as much as I meant to. These days it's extremely common for supposed "metalheads" to whine about elitism (or as they call it, "gatekeeping") whenever someone has any sort of minor criticism. Like when you criticize some kind of "NWOTHM" band, you're supposed to accept it because "it's new and sounds good" or else you get called a "gatekeeper", when in reality you could be giving constructive criticism instead of outright calling a band shit. I've had this happen in large metal chatrooms and forums many times. Like I find a few modern "traditional" metal bands to be quite good, but I find the vast majority to be very derivative, and they tend to sound more like generic watered down speed or thrash metal rather than classic Heavy Metal (which is what traditional metal is supposed to be).... but maybe that would be good for a different thread topic.

[Khnud]

I have no idea whether I qualify as a metalhead or not, and honestly I couldn't care less.

[VictimeDelExil]

I have no idea whether I qualify as a metalhead or not, and honestly I couldn't care less.

That's good, because I find the term "metalhead" to be quite abysmal. And really it tends to apply more to camo-short wearing death metal fans than people who like obscure 80s heavy metal.

[Khnud]

That's good

*shrug* As I said, don't care.

really it tends to apply more to camo-short wearing death metal fans than people who like obscure 80s heavy metal.

I don't think you're the judicial entity on what constitutes a metalhead.

[VictimeDelExil]

That's good

*shrug* As I said, don't care.

really it tends to apply more to camo-short wearing death metal fans than people who like obscure 80s heavy metal.

I don't think you're the judicial entity on what constitutes a metalhead.

Never said I was, or that there IS such an entity. I'm just saying that now-a-days the term "metalhead" is usually used to refer to extreme metal fans. Don't really understand the tone of your response sir.

[mordred]

It's quite humorous to see you belittle me for my age, when that is besides my point - I was ranting about people who don't discover bands on their own and just get their taste from some sort of "tastemaker" webzine or quasi-celebrity.

Wasn’t belittling at all, thought that was clear. Just saying I have listened longer because I am older, others have listened longer than me because they are older still. It’s not important. It’s also not important wether you discovered Manilla Road in a Fenriz blog post or some more “organic” means. Any way you found music to enjoy is good for you.

[Cochino]

That's the thing. We all have had different experiences, and they're all "true" as long as they're honest. I didn't have an older brother/friend to get me into Metal. I just had to find my way into it and it meant getting into stuff like The Prodigy when I was 9 (I was born in 87), liking the guitar stuff and moving on to bands like Nine Inch Nails, Body Count, Rammstein and some Nu-Metal bands that should never be mentioned on this forum
After that, and finding out that what I liked the most were the heaviest songs, I moved on to Pantera, Metallica, Megadeth and by 2002/2003 I had already turned into a fully fledged "old school" metalhead, leaving behind most of those bands I mentioned (I still like 90s Prodigy and the first two Body Count albums though). How "true" is that? Well, it's 100% true because that's what happened and I don't think anybody can question my absolute honest passion for Metal of all sorts. And yes, I did find out about bands like Venom 'cause I saw Phil Anselmo wearing the shirt. How bad can that be if now I love Venom as much as anyone who might have bought the LP through mail order back in the day?

A much healthier approach to this subject would be just asking how anyone live their "metalness" in their own way, to see how it's been quite a different voyage for all of us depending on age, location, obligations and many other things that make each experience unique, rather than trying to establish any sort of canonical "true" way.

Now, I do understand your frustration because there are people who just blindly follow trends without an ounce of personal taste being involved. That kinda shit can be really annoying, but those people eventually fall by the wayside and it's actually that kind of gatekeeping way of thinking that breeds them anyway. Getting too frustrated about those things might eventually get you burned out on the "scene" and can even lead to you abandon it. Just enjoy what you enjoy, and try to ignore what you don't.

[VictimeDelExil]

It's quite humorous to see you belittle me for my age, when that is besides my point - I was ranting about people who don't discover bands on their own and just get their taste from some sort of "tastemaker" webzine or quasi-celebrity.

Wasn’t belittling at all, thought that was clear. Just saying I have listened longer because I am older, others have listened longer than me because they are older still. It’s not important. It’s also not important wether you discovered Manilla Road in a Fenriz blog post or some more “organic” means. Any way you found music to enjoy is good for you.

Eh sorry about that, I have a tendency to sometimes misunderstand things in written formats. But yeah, I mean if someone got into MR through Fenriz it's cool, I'm just saying I think people who only copy someone else's taste are a problem.

That's the thing. We all have had different experiences, and they're all "true" as long as they're honest. I didn't have an older brother/friend to get me into Metal. I just had to find my way into it and it meant getting into stuff like The Prodigy when I was 9 (I was born in 87), liking the guitar stuff and moving on to bands like Nine Inch Nails, Body Count, Rammstein and some Nu-Metal bands that should never be mentioned on this forum
After that, and finding out that what I liked the most were the heaviest songs, I moved on to Pantera, Metallica, Megadeth and by 2002/2003 I had already turned into a fully fledged "old school" metalhead, leaving behind most of those bands I mentioned (I still like 90s Prodigy and the first two Body Count albums though). How "true" is that? Well, it's 100% true because that's what happened and I don't think anybody can question my absolute honest passion for Metal of all sorts. And yes, I did find out about bands like Venom 'cause I saw Phil Anselmo wearing the shirt. How bad can that be if now I love Venom as much as anyone who might have bought the LP through mail order back in the day?

A much healthier approach to this subject would be just asking how anyone live their "metalness" in their own way, to see how it's been quite a different voyage for all of us depending on age, location, obligations and many other things that make each experience unique, rather than trying to establish any sort of canonical "true" way.

Now, I do understand your frustration because there are people who just blindly follow trends without an ounce of personal taste being involved. That kinda shit can be really annoying, but those people eventually fall by the wayside and it's actually that kind of gatekeeping way of thinking that breeds them anyway. Getting too frustrated about those things might eventually get you burned out on the "scene" and can even lead to you abandon it. Just enjoy what you enjoy, and try to ignore what you don't.

And yeah, I apologize I do have a rather "blunt" way of wording things, so it may come across as I am antagonizing others, when that's not my intention. But again, I agree with your points. The problem for me is, as I mentioned, there's some people who just mindlessly copy other's taste and then pretend to be metal "experts". And I think that is a bit of a problem in the current metal scene, along with [younger] people who just casually listen, don't go to shows, or play instruments, and then claim "the metal scene is dead". I know I'm going off-topic from my reply to your post, but it has to do with the overall point I was trying to make in the thread, originally.
I think it's cool you got into metal as a transition from what people would call "false metal" into more obscure "true metal". For me I was always primarily into just classic Heavy Metal, I got into metal through hearing Accept, Black Sabbath, Scorpions, Iron Maiden as a younger kid - I ventured into some Thrash Metal (mostly mainstream stuff) but also read up on the New Wave of British Heavy Metal, and found some of the more well known bands, and dug deeper from there.