Nazis in (extreme) Metal

['pataphysicien]

[Since this discussion about Nazis in extreme metal has broaden a bit and it doesn't concern only the newer bands, this thread is being moved to Into Battle/Mod.]

just quoting myself from another thread, concerning the godly sounds on the new Arghoslent.

"it's been a long time since I've listened to Arghoslent. they were always something different in the death metal world. your post actually made me check out that album. about halfway into it, but to my ears this is the best they have ever done! even if your're not into death metal you should check this out. a rare and awesome cross of heavy and death. COULD definitely be up there IF...

there were not the ever-looming shadow of them being racist fucks, however cryptic or blunt they are in lyrics and interviews, one example: split with der stürmer and mudoven, lyrics on metal-archives, makes me want to vomit. guilty pleasure that could not be guiltier. it also makes the pleasure half as pleasurable. on the other hand no problem for me downloading the album. on yet another hand, should I even talk about the music here? oh fuck it. I'll just make another thread.."

you see my predicament. I hate it. I guess that there are not so many Black Metal fans on here, but you'll surely have noticed how that scene has gotten an awful case of the brown infiltration. as most of that stuff is incredibly generic there is no problem for me, mostly. do you guys ever come across this? any thoughts?

edit: I hope this doesn't fall outside the board scope. I've seen a number of people mentioning extreme metal bands, but feel free to move it/delete it.

and I don't want to restrict this to extreme metal, but the phenomenon seems much more seldom in heavy metal circles. or maybe I'm mistaken?

[DaN]

I would probably have it easier to handle if it just wasn't "Metal" in any shape or form. Got a weak spot for DER BLUTHARSCH for instance (mainly due to my The Moon Lies Hidden Beneath A Cloud-fandom..)

...but generally a band like this would have to be pretty effin' special and original for me to even bother. Not a common trait in this "scene".

['pataphysicien]

Not a common trait in this "scene".

that's always been my impression, but as there seem to be so many here who are so much more knowledgeable than me, so I thought I might as well ask. and in my experience metal fandom rarely cuts off cleanly at "scene" corners. hell, I would recommend Arghoslent to probably most on here if it weren't for the horrible politics..

hehe, now I'm curious about that "Moon" band you mentioned. I checked out some neofolk/whatevercomeswithit but haven't heard of them.

[bigfootkit]

I don't want to restrict this to extreme metal, but the phenomenon seems much more seldom in heavy metal circles. or maybe I'm mistaken?

I seem to recall reading that Witchfinder General had some links to extreme right groups, and were friendly with Nazi band Skrewdriver, but thankfully, i've come across very little or no overt rascism or right wing politics either in the music or amongst people on "the scene" over the years.
Hopefully, it will remain this way, but as we enter a global recession, history suggests that there will be a rise in right wing politics as a result, so no doubt some will find their way into the metal community, and will hopefully be chased straight back out.
I'm not into the extreme metal scene at all, but a friend who's into all that stuff tells me there are quite a few Eastern European black metal bands who use their music to spread this type of message unfortunately.

[DaN]

I seem to recall reading that Witchfinder General had some links to extreme right groups, and were friendly with Nazi band Skrewdriver,

Interesting.. Source?

I'm not into the extreme metal scene at all, but a friend who's into all that stuff tells me there are quite a few Eastern European black metal bands who use their music to spread this type of message unfortunately.

Nothing new there. I'm firm in my opinion that KORROZIA METALLA made 2 of the best late 80's/early 90's Thrash albums recorded, but when their vaudeville-antics turned to serious politics their music (thankfully) went shit as well. Around the same time some of these west/east-euro BM bands started flirtin' with Herr-Flick-aestetics too, but that whole scene never caught my attention.... And thus very off-topic for The Corroseum to be frank.

[Stormspell]

Oh no! Yet another Agroslent topic *puke*

[Helm]

I don't care for them personally. Just riffs don't do it for me.

[The Knell]

sadly there is much excellent metal ruined by bs thoughts

GBK/Arghoslent are sort of unclear but both are excellent musicially no doubt in that

[Cochino]

Personally I don't care that much about lyrics, otherwise I wouldn't be able to listen to most bands. Of course if waht they sing is aboiut racism and other nazi related stuff they music has to be too good for me to enjoy it. Most of the times the bullshit of the lyrics surpasses the quality, but I hear some sort of racist or totalitarian music. Haven't heard this particular band though, and honestly I'm not very much interested.

[daniel]

Check that out:

http://www.thelefthandpath.com/lefthand ... Arghoslent

And sorry but I find it beyond ridiculous saying ARGHOSLENT are 'just riffs', give me a break!!!

[Helm]

daniel from the link you present

There is no contradiction. The lyrics are always written after the music; the riffs come first, and it has always been about the riffs, about painting pictures and illustrating scenes.

It's ridiculous to pretend to be some sort of deeply-insightful artist in these genres. If one craves profundity, listen to Mussorgsky; if one craves poetic art, listen to Vicente Amigo. If one responds to riffs and thrash, listen to Metal.

Now here's the thing: I don't think Arghoslent are 'just riffs', and I didn't say that. I said that riffs for me, are not enough. In that Arghoslent have the riffs but they are lacking in other departments. So not only you misunderstood me and called an opinion you thought I had ridiculous, you are also at odds with the interpretation of the music by the band itself.

I'll give you a break, though. Here's a break:

[bigfootkit]

I seem to recall reading that Witchfinder General had some links to extreme right groups, and were friendly with Nazi band Skrewdriver,

Interesting.. Source?

I can't say for sure, but i do remember reading that piece while the band were still active in their original incarnation, so that narrows it down a little. So it was probably in Kerrang!, but Sounds is also a possibility. This was 25 years ago, or thereabouts, so my memory is a little fuzzy on the matter.
Another band who also seemed to have leanings in that direction, (at least by assosciation), were Thrash band Bomb Disneyland (later Bomb Everything). I don't recall anything on their album "Why Not?" giving that type of impression, but at a gig in Glasgow in the late '80's/early '90's, they brought a load of their friends up from England for the show who were skinheads and thought it great fun to throw seig heil salutes throughout the bands set. Unsurprisingly this went down very badly, and created a bad atmosphere for the remainder of the night.

[Mr Nuke]

As far as I know, Metal never was about being politically correct.

And it's always a pleasure to see people complaining about Metal bands being "political" while supporting bands that play in "Live Aid" festivals, that preach about political subjects, etc, but in a leftist way, so it's not "politics"...

And I'm sure some people will call me a fascist or so -while in reality fascism died in 1945, for those who don't open history books-, or at least they think I am one of this "scum" (strangely, the reds use the same vocabulary as the brown to describe their enemies : "low-fronted", "scum", etc) without writing it. But I don't care and I have nothing to prove, here or elsewhere. Firstly because my beliefs make proselytism a mortal sin. And political correctness, be it from right-wing or left-wing, is another mortal sin too...

ARGHOSLENT are one of the better bands around, and not only musically. I wish more bands, whatever ideas they support and write in their lyrics, would reach such standards in providing quality music and lyrics, while staying true to their ideals.

EDIT : Typos and grammar.

[great_knuthulhu]

Remember this: it's only political correctnes if you say it because you think that's what's expected of you. An opinion cannot be PC if it is what you really think. I'm getting tired of people playing the "you're just being PC" to people who have real ideals that they care about.

And where in the world do you live Mr. Nuke to think Fascism died in 1945?! It's been alive and well in different places for years, most famously in Franco's Spain.

And for the record, I happen to think fascism in music is an abomination and I stay the hell away from it, especially if the band seem to actually be into it.

[Cochino]

I think that being "politically correct" has nothing to do with the discussion we're having here, because being deliberately "politically incorrect" (I use the quote marks because I don't share the vision of what common sense calls correct and incorrect) is just as dumb as being deliberately "politically correct" and I think that if not all, most people on the forum will agree about that.
I don't bash Nazi bands because they're political. If that's the way they think at least that's honest. But since they're getting political and giving importance to that over or at the same level than music then I can get political and reject them 'cause I don't agree with their politics.
In the other hand, when their being Nazi in just a goofy, rebel, superficial level, then I can listen to their music without being affected by the ideology, because obviously the music plays a more important part than the lyrics.