True Doom Power

[Black Axe]

What about early Cathedral??

They really revolutionized doom as we used to know it? I remember it being quite unique at the time...

Or were they just posers & lucky they became quite popular??

Flutes, grunts and all were all already present. After the first stuff they did become posers, but the first album is real doom metal.

[DMR]

anything looking suspiciously hippy-ish

That disqualifies Black Sabbath, and probably Cathedral too.

[Black Axe]

anything looking suspiciously hippy-ish

That disqualifies Black Sabbath, and probably Cathedral too.

I see distinct differences.

[msp]

Yes, one photo is in black and white

[Dodens Grav]

anything southern lord related

Internal Void?

[GJ]

DaN, it is my belief the word "true" needs a hammerfall treatment!

[Ernest Thesiger]

After the first stuff they did become posers

Eh? They weren't "posing", they just got a bit comical.

DaN, it is my belief the word "true" needs a my gay lover treatment!

Replace it with "tripe", maybe? Or "tribble"?

[Satan is Our Pal]

What about early Cathedral??

They really revolutionized doom as we used to know it? I remember it being quite unique at the time...

Or were they just posers & lucky they became quite popular??

Nope these did the hard slog playing on "Grind" bills with fucking idots stage diving etc. They've evolved into one of the finest British Metal acts of all time, who didn't become posers but harvested a more humorous side to themselves. Listening to The Forest LP the day it came out blow me away.They became popular because they are fucking great Korgy.

I don't fully understand peoples take on what constitutes a doom band. Discharge are a doom band, Pagan Altar have never been a doom band to my ears.

[Ernest Thesiger]

No, Doom are a Discharge band!

[Satan is Our Pal]

No, Doom are a Discharge band!

Bugger off!

[Black Axe]

I don't fully understand peoples take on what constitutes a doom band.

You don't understand doom.

[nightsblood]

I like Altar of Oblivion and the latest Gates of Slumber. I never got into many of the Maryland doom bands other than Pentagram. Don't know why, other than many of them seemed too similar to The Obsessed.

I don't really think those Md/Va bands all sound like THE OBSESSED at all to be honest. I think all of them have their own sound. ASYLUM sound different than INTERNAL VOID, than REVELATION, than DEATH MASK than IRON MAN, etc.

There's 2 more I mentioned worth checking out.

Could be that I'm just not familiar enough with the scene or haven't heard the 'right' Md doom bands. It's another of those corners of the metal underground I need to explore more thoroughly someday

[ION BRITTON]

No, Doom are a Discharge band!

Haha, true, a bit more pissed off dudes though.

['pataphysicien]

I don't fully understand peoples take on what constitutes a doom band. Discharge are a doom band, Pagan Altar have never been a doom band to my ears.

I agree with you here. Discharge have everything Doom is to me, except for the slow riffs. this discussion is a regular on all kinds of forums, but I never felt that a final word was spoken. I also don't think it can be spoken. I could list all the bands that are somehow pure to me, but their musical output would be sonically and thematically very diverse. Doom is only one word and in the end each band is a whole universe in itself, spelling Doom in specific and contingent ways. sure, one could go collecting adjectives, lyrical themes and sonic trademarks, but each band will be judged in their time, their networks. according to relevant traditions, power relations, money, exposure, interests etc.

at some level it seems to me that the people concerned with trueness in Doom are some of the most critical and hardest to please fans. the discussions tend to gravitate around origin stories of the genre, albums defining subgenres etc. and they may seem very conservative. paradoxically the genre is innovated all the time. Reverend Bizarre, The Lamp of Thoth, the last Revelation album.. where do those fit in the templates? sure it's possible to trace their sounds and themes to the big traditions at some level, but those bands/that album traced an original path. true/pure to me nonetheless.

sorry for the rambling. every time I try to get to some bottom with this it slips away. for some weird reason we are concerned with trueness, but why it is so important and where it comes from are weird questions to me. for myself I just feel myself gravitating around some nexus of feelings I seem to look for in music, but surely there is more that makes me go 'fuck yes, this is Doom!'. how would I know where to look without people devoted to some traditions and the networks of people that produce, listen to and label music? the idea of true or pure surely is produced by all of these things and we're making it as we go along, not from thin air, but also not from some given universal we can just tap.

[Lama]

@ Black Axe

So tell me why Cathedral are 'posers'? Maybe the stuff they did after "Forest..." isn't your thing, and I respect that, but that's no reason for calling them 'posers'.

I think both Lee Dorrian and Gary Jennings are great musicians, who made, and still make, a lot of good music. They know their music history, are obscure music collectors themselves, and I find Rise Above one of the most interesting 'popular' labels around.