Late 70s/early 80s influenced NWOTHM

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sonan
Posts: 1

Re: Late 70s/early 80s influenced NWOTHM

Post#16 » Tue Jan 05, 2021 4:08 pm


Lord_Sauron
Posts: 49

Re: Late 70s/early 80s influenced NWOTHM

Post#17 » Sat Aug 14, 2021 2:44 pm

sonan wrote:
Tue Jan 05, 2021 4:08 pm
Freeroad from Mexico.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEv6u4RfJe8
Sorry for not answering earlier, I really had no time to update this topic.

This one sounds VERY promising - real traditional metal without those (to me uninteresting) USPM and speed/melothrash influences.

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bigfootkit
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Re: Late 70s/early 80s influenced NWOTHM

Post#18 » Wed Aug 25, 2021 2:06 am

Lord_Sauron wrote:
Sat Aug 14, 2021 2:44 pm
sonan wrote:
Tue Jan 05, 2021 4:08 pm
Freeroad from Mexico.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEv6u4RfJe8
Sorry for not answering earlier, I really had no time to update this topic.

This one sounds VERY promising - real traditional metal without those (to me uninteresting) USPM and speed/melothrash influences.
These guys are new to me, but they've got a great sound. You can clearly hear their influences but there's enough individual character and songwriting know-how there to set them apart from most of those retro wannabes & outright imitators. Catchy, concise and melodic without ever getting sappy. Very impressive, particularly the guitars.
Seems most of the band are also members of a more 70s/classic rock sounding group called Lonesome Trail too. Not what this thread is seeking, but if you do appreciate that style they may be up your street.
I cannot, I shall not, I will not obey.
Avenger wrote : I'm not a copyright office nor a judicial entity.

Lord_Sauron
Posts: 49

Re: Late 70s/early 80s influenced NWOTHM

Post#19 » Wed Sep 01, 2021 4:47 pm

bigfootkit wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 2:06 am
These guys are new to me, but they've got a great sound. You can clearly hear their influences but there's enough individual character and songwriting know-how there to set them apart from most of those retro wannabes & outright imitators. Catchy, concise and melodic without ever getting sappy. Very impressive, particularly the guitars.
Seems most of the band are also members of a more 70s/classic rock sounding group called Lonesome Trail too. Not what this thread is seeking, but if you do appreciate that style they may be up your street.
I gave them a listen and it is also a quite good band (although I slightly prefer Freeroad stylewise), despite not being on-topic here.

I agree with Your opinion on Freeroad and I have also listened to their newer song "Nature of Change": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVKZM9FRAYU. My personal taste aside (a lot of my favourite bands would be considered hard rock or even AOR by hardline "metal"-heads of post-thrash generation - which is my generation), I find it sad that there seems to be much less variety in modern "traditional" metal than it used to be. As one "Metal Archives" user wrote about the so-called NWOTHM: "[NWOTHM] is basically a narrow view of heavy/power metal as it sounded in the mid 80s. This has been true for nearly everything I've heard with the tag."

I find it quite sad, since nowadays it is much easier to listen to different bands and yet a lot of bands fit into what You have described as "those retro wannabes & outright imitators". I don't know if it is simply a lack of inspiration or fear of being rejected as "dad rock" bands by beforementioned hardliners if they incorporate some elements that are not considered "true metal" nowadays. Really, I am not oposed to bands playing heavy/speed metal or USPM or anything like that (I even enjoy some 80s bands whose style has been described as such), but find it a bit iritating when bands whose main influences are clearly albums such as Painkiller (a good album, btw) or late-80s epic metal bands, are being described as traditional early-80s/NWOBHM-like metal.

An indicative conversation I had with a very good friend of mine (who is also the only one that listens primarily to metal in our group of friends), who is slightly younger than me (26-27 years old at the time). He told me he considers early Judas Prieast to be "rock, not even hard rock, but just [classic] rock". I thought he was refering to Rocka Rolla and actually agreed with him, saying it "could be called 70s hard rock, but that I see his point". Turns out that he was refering to their EIGHTIES output (and I am not talking only Point of Entry or Turbo). From what I have heard from few other guys of the same generation, it seems that it is a common opinion.

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bigfootkit
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Re: Late 70s/early 80s influenced NWOTHM

Post#20 » Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:59 am

Lord_Sauron wrote:
Wed Sep 01, 2021 4:47 pm
bigfootkit wrote:
Wed Aug 25, 2021 2:06 am
These guys are new to me, but they've got a great sound. You can clearly hear their influences but there's enough individual character and songwriting know-how there to set them apart from most of those retro wannabes & outright imitators. Catchy, concise and melodic without ever getting sappy. Very impressive, particularly the guitars.
Seems most of the band are also members of a more 70s/classic rock sounding group called Lonesome Trail too. Not what this thread is seeking, but if you do appreciate that style they may be up your street.
I gave them a listen and it is also a quite good band (although I slightly prefer Freeroad stylewise), despite not being on-topic here.

I agree with Your opinion on Freeroad and I have also listened to their newer song "Nature of Change": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sVKZM9FRAYU. My personal taste aside (a lot of my favourite bands would be considered hard rock or even AOR by hardline "metal"-heads of post-thrash generation - which is my generation), I find it sad that there seems to be much less variety in modern "traditional" metal than it used to be. As one "Metal Archives" user wrote about the so-called NWOTHM: "[NWOTHM] is basically a narrow view of heavy/power metal as it sounded in the mid 80s. This has been true for nearly everything I've heard with the tag."

I find it quite sad, since nowadays it is much easier to listen to different bands and yet a lot of bands fit into what You have described as "those retro wannabes & outright imitators". I don't know if it is simply a lack of inspiration or fear of being rejected as "dad rock" bands by beforementioned hardliners if they incorporate some elements that are not considered "true metal" nowadays. Really, I am not oposed to bands playing heavy/speed metal or USPM or anything like that (I even enjoy some 80s bands whose style has been described as such), but find it a bit iritating when bands whose main influences are clearly albums such as Painkiller (a good album, btw) or late-80s epic metal bands, are being described as traditional early-80s/NWOBHM-like metal.

An indicative conversation I had with a very good friend of mine (who is also the only one that listens primarily to metal in our group of friends), who is slightly younger than me (26-27 years old at the time). He told me he considers early Judas Prieast to be "rock, not even hard rock, but just [classic] rock". I thought he was refering to Rocka Rolla and actually agreed with him, saying it "could be called 70s hard rock, but that I see his point". Turns out that he was refering to their EIGHTIES output (and I am not talking only Point of Entry or Turbo). From what I have heard from few other guys of the same generation, it seems that it is a common opinion.
We are of a like mind LordSauron. When i was a kid getting into heavy music it was a broad church with all kinds of different influences and approaches, the rules & categorisations weren't yet set in stone & no-one was policing things to define what was tr00 or not. It wasn't a black and white 'Metal or Not' choice, everything which fell into a vague 'heavy' category was there to be enjoyed.
To me everything from AC/DC to VOIVOD, SOD to UFO, MERCYFUL FATE to SKYNYRD are just different shades of the same colour, and the more individual the band the better.
For a genre of music which lyrically is so much about defiance, self-expression & individuality there sadly seems to be an awful lot of rules to be conformed to nowadays.
I cannot, I shall not, I will not obey.
Avenger wrote : I'm not a copyright office nor a judicial entity.

Lord_Sauron
Posts: 49

Re: Late 70s/early 80s influenced NWOTHM

Post#21 » Tue Sep 21, 2021 2:00 pm

bigfootkit wrote:
Thu Sep 16, 2021 5:59 am
We are of a like mind LordSauron. When i was a kid getting into heavy music it was a broad church with all kinds of different influences and approaches, the rules & categorisations weren't yet set in stone & no-one was policing things to define what was tr00 or not. It wasn't a black and white 'Metal or Not' choice, everything which fell into a vague 'heavy' category was there to be enjoyed.
To me everything from AC/DC to VOIVOD, SOD to UFO, MERCYFUL FATE to SKYNYRD are just different shades of the same colour, and the more individual the band the better.
For a genre of music which lyrically is so much about defiance, self-expression & individuality there sadly seems to be an awful lot of rules to be conformed to nowadays.
Couldn't word it better myself. I have also seen the shift from themes such as "defiance, self-expression & individuality" to different subjects. I am wondering if it is at least partially connected with increased conformism in style.

Even if we exclude more extreme genres, when I see tag "NWOBHM", I don't know what to expect stylewise. It can be anything from proto-glam metal and metallic AOR to rocky traditional metal a la Saxon, to proto-speed metal and early epic heavy metal, where we can see embrionic stages of pretty much every heavy metal subgenre that appeared in the later half of the 80s. Of course, I prefer sme of these styles more than I prefer others, but still, there is a lot of variety present.

When I see "NWOTHM", I can pretty much guess what it would sound for about 4 out of 5 bands. Although, it isn't actually that much about the style (de gustibus...), but the feeling I have that many of these bands play that style because it is expected from them as "traditional metal" bands and not because they don't want to implement other influences.

Not that things are better with other "revival" genres, such as glam revival, new wave of thrash and all those "70s-influenced" bands apprearing at various times during last two decades.

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Cochino
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Re: Late 70s/early 80s influenced NWOTHM

Post#22 » Thu Sep 23, 2021 4:50 pm

I think labels are extremely useful and helpful, specially on these days where there's so much stuff out there you need as much help as you can in order to decide what you're gonna spend your time and money on. You can't compare how it is now than in the 70s or early 80s, where you only had a handful of heavy bands out there to begin with, let alone whatever managed to reach your record store.
The problem to me nowadays is that those labels should come after the fact, to describe the music that's already made. Many newer bands seem to choose the label before they even put down the first note, so you get the feeling that the creative process is actually more of a box checking exercise.

Lord_Sauron
Posts: 49

Re: Late 70s/early 80s influenced NWOTHM

Post#23 » Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:10 pm

Cochino wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 4:50 pm
I think labels are extremely useful and helpful, specially on these days where there's so much stuff out there you need as much help as you can in order to decide what you're gonna spend your time and money on. You can't compare how it is now than in the 70s or early 80s, where you only had a handful of heavy bands out there to begin with, let alone whatever managed to reach your record store.
The problem to me nowadays is that those labels should come after the fact, to describe the music that's already made. Many newer bands seem to choose the label before they even put down the first note, so you get the feeling that the creative process is actually more of a box checking exercise.
I agree with You 100% percent. The thing in bold is precisely what I was saying. It would be useless to compare number of "heavy" subgenres in early-80s and now, but, taking specifically traditional metal, what You have descibed as "a box checking exercise" is becoming more and more obvious with the passing of time. Even in the early-2000s, it was not that obvious.

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bigfootkit
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Re: Late 70s/early 80s influenced NWOTHM

Post#24 » Fri Oct 01, 2021 5:24 am

Lord_Sauron wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 11:10 pm
Cochino wrote:
Thu Sep 23, 2021 4:50 pm
I think labels are extremely useful and helpful, specially on these days where there's so much stuff out there you need as much help as you can in order to decide what you're gonna spend your time and money on. You can't compare how it is now than in the 70s or early 80s, where you only had a handful of heavy bands out there to begin with, let alone whatever managed to reach your record store.
The problem to me nowadays is that those labels should come after the fact, to describe the music that's already made. Many newer bands seem to choose the label before they even put down the first note, so you get the feeling that the creative process is actually more of a box checking exercise.
I agree with You 100% percent. The thing in bold is precisely what I was saying. It would be useless to compare number of "heavy" subgenres in early-80s and now, but, taking specifically traditional metal, what You have descibed as "a box checking exercise" is becoming more and more obvious with the passing of time. Even in the early-2000s, it was not that obvious.
The fact that 'NWOBHM' really describes a time-frame rather than a specific genre sound to me was one of it's huge strengths, because in investigating this rather vague label you became exposed to so many different styles & gained an appreciation for different facets of the overall sound, expanding your appreciation of music in general.
Someone might go into it looking for something that sounds like Venom but instead find someone like Saracen or Legend and discover that (though it wasn't exactly what they set out trying to find) there was still much to appreciate.
Having said all that, true fans of the genre know exactly where the stylistic outer edges are that stop a record being considered NWOBHM, and there ought to be a special place in hell for those unscrupulous types who are fond of peddling completely unconnected records by slapping the 'NWOBHM' tag on them. The 'broad church' argument is no defence for their shitty practices.
The subgenre labels were very helpful back in the pre-internet days, but less so nowadays as you can usually find opportunities online to hear at least some of what you're thinking of buying before shelling out cash for it.
As a kid with very limited funds & little knowledge i was often groping in the dark and gambling on record purchases going on nothing but band names, logos, cover art, song titles & band photos as a rough idea to what the grooves contained. My most wayward purchase at that time was an album from Krautrockers Amon Düül II called 'Phallus Dei'. I was confident that as they had long hair and their name contained umlauts (which i'd only ever seen before on Motörhead's logo), then they must be similarly heavy. A very disappointing & utterly bewildering purchase to my 11 year old self. :lol:
I cannot, I shall not, I will not obey.
Avenger wrote : I'm not a copyright office nor a judicial entity.

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