the Die Hard vinyl mania

All vinyl-specific issues goes in this here subforum.
decibelrebel
Posts: 180

Post#16 » Mon Oct 08, 2007 5:37 am

the term diehard definitely predates NWN, vinyl did not start and nor will it finish with this stupid fucking rerelease obsessed "label".

diehard versions should be for the diehard fan rather than the diehard investor, a way of the band acknowledging the supporters that have been with them since the garage days instead of just a clever way for a label to recover some of the immediate outlay to release the thing by this gimmicky 'available from the label only' release loaded with plastic fantastic cereal box toys

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Astaroth
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Post#17 » Mon Oct 08, 2007 4:20 pm

decibelrebel wrote:the term diehard definitely predates NWN, vinyl did not start and nor will it finish with this stupid fucking rerelease obsessed "label".

diehard versions should be for the diehard fan rather than the diehard investor, a way of the band acknowledging the supporters that have been with them since the garage days instead of just a clever way for a label to recover some of the immediate outlay to release the thing by this gimmicky 'available from the label only' release loaded with plastic fantastic cereal box toys
:lol:

I agree and am glad to see I'm not the only one who thinks so.
Diehard versions SHOULD be for the diehard fan and not for investors but unfortunately that's not the case more often than not.

I vote for the diehard verion idea to be renamed to tryhard versions. They can come with VIP collector cards, cereal box toys, fridge magnets, coasters, pins, patches, badges, 3D glasses, bottle openers and other useless shit. Give me the black fucking LP to play the music on.

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convent guilt
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Post#18 » Wed Oct 10, 2007 6:14 am

Yep, in this day and age:

Die hard = Try hard

There is NOTHING, I repeat, NOTHING wrong with a well-presented black vinyl LP with insert. How many people actually use half of the extras that come with records these days?

These sort of gimmicks are nothing new, though they are much more prevalent these days. Look at the Sodom 'Agent orange' box thing that came out years ago for an example. The difference is, it was unique. Now that every second label is in on the act the magic has gone.

But yeah, if I don't like it I don't have to buy it, right?

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Abyss
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Post#19 » Wed Oct 10, 2007 6:49 am

The problem is when the true fans buy up all the normal versions, these investors who bought all of the "die hard" versions swoop in and sell these versions to people who missed out on the normal version at inflated prices.

Seeing some random investor who doesn't give two shit about the band making more off one album than the band made off 10 or so is quite sickening.

puist
Posts: 9

Post#20 » Sat Nov 03, 2007 3:49 pm

There are to many die-hards these days. Many labels release them by just adding a tshirt/sticker/patch whatever. I don't call that die hard.
I believe a die hard item should be something special. Leather covers, cloth gatefold covers, etc.

For example Sabbat's Triple UUU 2LP released by HMSS (thumbnails):
Image
Image
Image
Image

2 picture discs with one side completly covered by cloth. All handmade. That I consider die hard.

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doomedplanet
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Post#21 » Sat Nov 03, 2007 7:24 pm

that is a weird looking release. So does that mean each one is a clear vinyl lp with something hand glued destroying the grooves on one side?? Something like Azra records might have done back in the day?

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Keir
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Post#22 » Sun Nov 04, 2007 4:39 am

convent guilt wrote:These sort of gimmicks are nothing new, though they are much more prevalent these days. Look at the Sodom 'Agent orange' box thing that came out years ago for an example.
Haha. You mean the big metal can? I remember buying that back when it came out. I could never figure out where to keep it and finally sold it off.

Nowadays, I only buy old vinyl anyway. I prefer my reissues on CD.

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nightsblood
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Post#23 » Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:09 am

Interesting topic. I agree with the orig. post that it's an interesting trend that's cropped up and I'm not sure what to make of it. Personally, I'd have to really like the band to spend the extra $ to get the die hard edition. Regarding some of the complaints mentioned:
--there's almost always a plain black vinyl version also available so you can just get that if it's what you prefer.
--I've never really 'gotten' the whole Black sounds better than Colored vinyl thing; maybe my ears aren't as discerning as some people's, but I've honestly never noticed a difference.
--I agree that I hate it when you can't tell which color of vinyl you're getting when you buy an album. Most of the time I don't care so long as I get a copy, but sometimes a person wants a specific one and they shouldn't have to get lucky to pick the right one. You wouldn't go into a record store and buy an album without knowing the band or the title.
--hardcore fans will probably appreciate the extra items even if they seem gimmicky to others.
--investors are always looking to make money by re-selling limited ed. items once they are no longer available. If they try to charge too much for the item, the prospective buyer can always say No and wait until they find a cheaper copy.
--As for NWN, I'm not into most of the bands they put material out for, but they've always done a great job the few times I've ordered from them and I've always gotten the sense that the fellow in charge is a real fan of the bands and tries to put out a really nice product for hardcore fans to enjoy.

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Nightlock
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Post#24 » Sun Nov 04, 2007 5:12 am

I completely agree with everything you've just said nightsblood to the letter. Everyone posting in this topic seems to be getting a bit jaded for little reason.
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Shadow Kingdom
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Post#25 » Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:27 am

One reason why people are buying more vinyl might be because CDs just might be phased out one day and investing in vinyl is not that much more expensive than a CD nowadays... I sell CDs and Vinyl for virtually the same price....

I grew up in the mid 90's and grew up on CDs and CD re-issues... I always had vinyl, but I'm buying more vinyl each year.... espically since labels are taking a much more serious approach to releasing vinyl than before... Miskatonic started releasing vinyl recently and I'm so glad because all his pressing are amazing and it's so great that they're going to get the wax they deserve...

I'm going to release vinyl and I don't go that nuts over die hards... I'm going to start releasing vinyl and only as per requests of the recent bands I'm signing they want colored vinyl, but I'm only doing 1/5 of the on deck pressings that way.... I'm not going to go out of my way to make a super badass die hard pressing unless a band really wants it....

I think it's good that labels make those die hards to make back their money.... Some people have no idea how much pressings, shipping charges, royalities for all these pressings are... it adds up real quick... Good thing there's great fans like the people here that want their collection to be real so we can keep doing it for you.

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Stormspell
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Post#26 » Sun Nov 04, 2007 6:54 am

I'll be talking of CD die-hard releases here but it is the same idea in general anyway. When I do a die-hard portion of a particular release I look at it as a way of recuperating CASH towards the release. Coz once the release is out all distros only want to trade for it. There are maybe 1 or 2 distros that come to me to buy a handfull on wholesale (Hail Ryosuke and Helmut!). All the rest are trades, and a week after you start trading it, you can go to eBay and find your release there for dirt cheap...

So I make 150 or so "die-hards" which I make available for pre-orders at my regular CD price at $11.99 and I also always offer them on wholesale too (for $8, while my wholesale price on "regular" editions is $7).

This is the only way I can ensure I'll have a portion of the pressing which will not pop out on eBay a week after the release date at some crazy under-wholesale prices.

decibelrebel
Posts: 180

Post#27 » Sun Nov 04, 2007 7:24 am

i still stand by everything i said previously but i'd also like to go on record and say stormspells diehards are great, nothing too outlandish, you don't spam the hell outta every board to drum up frenzied hype before its released, just some nice discreet tributes to a few great, and in the case of drifter, under appreciated, bands.

stormspell's diehards are quite humble little jewels & the distro is one of the most cooperative i've ever dealt with...no glory hunting here, just a heavy metal maniac making an honest contribution with a label profile that comes second to the music - how it should be.
stepping on toes since 1978

puist
Posts: 9

Post#28 » Sun Nov 04, 2007 9:36 am

doomedplanet wrote:that is a weird looking release. So does that mean each one is a clear vinyl lp with something hand glued destroying the grooves on one side?? Something like Azra records might have done back in the day?
Yes. It's an one-side clear vinyl. On the non-printed site a image and cloth is hand glued

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Mr Nuke
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Post#29 » Sun Nov 04, 2007 9:53 am

The problem is that some labels (the most prominent being NWN!) began a few years ago to do these die-hards as a trademark of their job. That was with quality bands, quality music, rare stuff mostly, etc.
Now everyone does this, with bands of lesser quality, for dubious rereleases not that hard to find (or for cheap on CD). And that we get only these "rereleases labels" that I find useless.
See NWN! One can say what he wants about him, yet among the most obvious rereleases (VON, etc) there were rereleases of more obscure stuff (TUDOR) or new records (ARES KINGDOM). That's a good job. Does every "rerelease label" follow this kind of policy?

Yet in the end, it's up to the customer/fan to choose. If one prefers to buy a deluxe picture-disc (i.e. with a dubious sound quality) rerelease of an album easy to find on CD at a decent price, that's his/her problem. But that's a waste of cash in my own case.
Gott ist tot.

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deathster
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Post#30 » Sun Nov 04, 2007 10:44 am

I do not understand this complaining about die-hards. I completely agree with "nightsblood" points. NWN! does great job although I am not fan of their all releases.
I think little credit to de-luxe LP/PicLP mania should be given to Iron Pegasus records too. They had some neat releases even before NWN! and I remember how astonished I was when I got Sabbat stuff when they were released in late 90s. Want examples? Sabbat "Envenom" PicLP w/LP sleeve + sticker on cover lim. .../100 pcs written with silver pen. I was amazed. Yosuke took one step or more further with some of his releases.

And this sound quality of PicLP versus black LP conversation I do not understand either. One must have very good turntable + needle, very hood ears/hearing and music must be played at low volume. How the hell you can tell the difference listening to Blasphemy "Fallen angel of Doom" and say you hear the difference in high volume. We love noise, the noisier the better!!!!! :) Besides, I started my heavy metal carrier 20 yeras ago listening to metal from 10th generation copy cassettes. So metal music must not be crystal clear to be good. Will you throw away your Blasfemia LPs because there is some additional noise on it (although its black vinyl)?

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