Gross. Especially when the majority of the bands previous albums slay the shit out of this one 10 times over.Helstar wrote:"Gutter Ballet" is the best album ever
Too many fucking keyboards and lack of balls.
Gross. Especially when the majority of the bands previous albums slay the shit out of this one 10 times over.Helstar wrote:"Gutter Ballet" is the best album ever
bigfootkit wrote:"Your Steel Is Not True"
stormspell wrote:"I hate all my releases. I only listen to Korn and Limp Bizkit, don't you know..."
Even the majority of the bands following albums slay the shit out of it as well.Avenger wrote:Gross. Especially when the majority of the bands previous albums slay the shit out of this one 10 times over.Helstar wrote:"Gutter Ballet" is the best album ever
Too many fucking keyboards and lack of balls.
Eh... no.Avenger wrote:Gross. Especially when the majority of the bands previous albums slay the shit out of this one 10 times over.Helstar wrote:"Gutter Ballet" is the best album ever
No, among Savatage fans who enjoy the whole or most of the catalogue, HOTMK is not as popular as Gutter Ballet, not even close. Just look at the common set list of Jon Oliva's Pain these days. He only does the title song of HOTMK, but loads of songs off Gutter Ballet and Streets, which are the most popular albums among his fans.Black Axe wrote:In The Hall... Of The Mountain King!!!!!mordred wrote:It's probably their most popular album too.
I think you're dead wrong here, HOTMK is a much more accessible album than Gutter Ballet. GB at the time was a very bold and adventurous record to make for Savatage. The material featured on it is by far the most complex, progressive, dynamic and challenging they had ever written. HOTMK on the other hand is, while also a masterpiece, an album that most metalheads can understand and get into much easier than Gutter Ballet. Additionally, HOTMK features what is possibly the most commercial song Savatage ever did (outisde Fight for the Rock anyway), "Strange Wings". There is nothing similar to that on Gutter Ballet.ION BRITTON wrote:HOTMK is the better album for me, but I'd agree that GB is more popular. It's simply more accessible material to wider audiences.
It matters not which album you like more of course but... Vocally, Jon Oliva definitely pushed his voice one step further with Gutter Ballet album. "When the Crowds are Gone", a ballad or not, features the highest screams and singing he ever recorded. There's lots of outrageous stuff too. "The Unholy" might be the fastest song Savatage ever recorded, "Hounds" is the doomiest one, "She's in Love" one of the most aggressive (again with some of Oliva's most insane vocals) and the lead riff of "Thorazine Shuffle" is as dark and heavy as anything on HOTMK. When discussing Gutter Ballet, many seem to only remember the two songs that had promo films made to them. Must be because they are two of the best songs in the world ever by any band.ION BRITTON wrote:but you know, more ballads, less vocal insanity, no crushing riffs ala Beyond the doors of the dark etc. make it easier to digest for their fans, either their metallers or not.
I think you are mixing it up with Streets: A Rock Opera, the album from 1991 that followed Gutter Ballet. That is a musical (and one of the best albums ever of course).GJ wrote:...and the crime of introducing the sissy "musical" genre into metal.
people, thats what i call being a fanmordred wrote:I think you're dead wrong here, HOTMK is a much more accessible album than Gutter Ballet. GB at the time was a very bold and adventurous record to make for Savatage. The material featured on it is by far the most complex, progressive, dynamic and challenging they had ever written. HOTMK on the other hand is, while also a masterpiece, an album that most metalheads can understand and get into much easier than Gutter Ballet. Additionally, HOTMK features what is possibly the most commercial song Savatage ever did (outisde Fight for the Rock anyway), "Strange Wings". There is nothing similar to that on Gutter Ballet.ION BRITTON wrote:HOTMK is the better album for me, but I'd agree that GB is more popular. It's simply more accessible material to wider audiences.
On a comparison with for instance Fates Warning, any earlier Savatage album is "Night on Bröcken" while Gutter Ballet is "Awaken the Guardian".
It matters not which album you like more of course but... Vocally, Jon Oliva definitely pushed his voice one step further with Gutter Ballet album. "When the Crowds are Gone", a ballad or not, features the highest screams and singing he ever recorded. There's lots of outrageous stuff too. "The Unholy" might be the fastest song Savatage ever recorded, "Hounds" is the doomiest one, "She's in Love" one of the most aggressive (again with some of Oliva's most insane vocals) and the lead riff of "Thorazine Shuffle" is as dark and heavy as anything on HOTMK. When discussing Gutter Ballet, many seem to only remember the two songs that had promo films made to them. Must be because they are two of the best songs in the world ever by any band.ION BRITTON wrote:but you know, more ballads, less vocal insanity, no crushing riffs ala Beyond the doors of the dark etc. make it easier to digest for their fans, either their metallers or not.
I think you are mixing it up with Streets: A Rock Opera, the album from 1991 that followed Gutter Ballet. That is a musical (and one of the best albums ever of course).GJ wrote:...and the crime of introducing the sissy "musical" genre into metal.
EDIT: Black Axe has changed for a very sexy avatar and signature... like all other Savatage albums, I know Handful of Rain forwards and backwards.
Since when did populartiy mean quality?mordred wrote:No, among Savatage fans who enjoy the whole or most of the catalogue, HOTMK is not as popular as Gutter Ballet, not even close. Just look at the common set list of Jon Oliva's Pain these days. He only does the title song of HOTMK, but loads of songs off Gutter Ballet and Streets, which are the most popular albums among his fans.Black Axe wrote:In The Hall... Of The Mountain King!!!!!mordred wrote:It's probably their most popular album too.
You know, some renounce Savatage after HOTMK because it was last album without keyboards, some renounce Savatage after Gutter Ballet because the following album (Streets) was so different, some renounce Savatage after Streets because it was the last album (or so it seemed at the time) with Jon Oliva on lead vocals, and some renounce Savatage after Edge of Thorns because it was the last album with Criss Oliva on guitar.
Outside the circle of renouncers, who are pretty much just fly by occasional listeners anyway, Gutter Ballet and Streets are likely the most popular albums.
bigfootkit wrote:"Your Steel Is Not True"
stormspell wrote:"I hate all my releases. I only listen to Korn and Limp Bizkit, don't you know..."
1. Savage + Avatar = Savatage (kinda)DaN wrote: Here's 2 stupid questions:
1. What the hell is a "savatage"??
2. How do you guys pronounce it? [Sávatidsch] or [Savatáah:sch]?
I think it's mentioned in one of the re-issues that Savatage is a combination of the words Sabotage and Savage. Also, try listening to their live albums. There you can hear the correct pronunciation.N.W.O.O.F.G.M. wrote:1. Savage + Avatar = Savatage (kinda)DaN wrote: Here's 2 stupid questions:
1. What the hell is a "savatage"??
2. How do you guys pronounce it? [Sávatidsch] or [Savatáah:sch]?
2. Most people here in Greece pronounce it as [Savatáah:sch]. The band did not seem to mind when they played down here.
I can't honestly pick one Savatage era as my favorite. All of them have their merits, and I do believe that GB (my favorite release of theirs) combines the best of both worlds, while offering some amazing songwriting.