Is Metal Music Spiritual?

Recommendations, discussions, questions & debates regarding the godly Metal of olde...

Is Metal Music Spiritual?

Hahaha... Are you kidding me?
6
38%
Hell no
4
25%
Yes, praise the loud. (Now quit crying about the poll options, it was a joke)
4
25%
Who cares. I'm listening to Slayer!!!
2
13%
 
Total votes: 16

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Avenger
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Post by Avenger »

Satan is Our Pal wrote:Avenger how many brain farts a day do you have? :D
None, I'm just a smartass...
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voidghast
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Post by voidghast »

Ok, so the word "spiritual" is kind of a dirty word it seems. If you are equating the word "spiritual" with "organized religion" then you are sort of off course. I use the word often when talking about music because to me, it implies a connection to something greater(the force/creative energy binding the universe together perhaps?). Music can affect me in a spiritual way, move me emotionally and connect with me on a deep level. The best heavy metal does exactly that and I regard it as more than just entertainment. I wouldn't meditate to it or anything haha. Whenever I think about "the spirit of heavy metal" I think about the greater ideas, archetypes, and perspective behind a good chunk of heavy metal music(what it represents in a sense). Bad heavy metal is just entertainment to me, something "fun" to listen to perhaps but nothing special. I don't feel as if it's embarrassing to get more out of heavy metal and use it as a kind of guide in your life. It's not about taking Manowar lyrics literally or trying to be the biggest metalhead..that's the surface stuff in my opinion. It's something that resonates with all our personalities/minds on a very deep level.
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Post by Avenger »

voidghast wrote:Ok, so the word "spiritual" is kind of a dirty word it seems. If you are equating the word "spiritual" with "organized religion" then you are sort of off course. I use the word often when talking about music because to me, it implies a connection to something greater(the force/creative energy binding the universe together perhaps?). Music can affect me in a spiritual way, move me emotionally and connect with me on a deep level. The best heavy metal does exactly that and I regard it as more than just entertainment. I wouldn't meditate to it or anything haha. Whenever I think about "the spirit of heavy metal" I think about the greater ideas, archetypes, and perspective behind a good chunk of heavy metal music(what it represents in a sense). Bad heavy metal is just entertainment to me, something "fun" to listen to perhaps but nothing special. I don't feel as if it's embarrassing to get more out of heavy metal and use it as a kind of guide in your life. It's not about taking Manowar lyrics literally or trying to be the biggest metalhead..that's the surface stuff in my opinion. It's something that resonates with all our personalities/minds on a very deep level.
Alright, so vote in the poll then.
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Post by Helm »

Poll and initial post are is not only wide from the mark, they're also annoyingly biased. Did not vote. Heavy Metal isn't spiritual for me, I do not believe in any god, demon, or spirit and I don't need Dio to be my god either. As mass of kthulhu says, perhaps 'a way of life' or 'intellectually charged' is something worth discussing so here, we'll hijack your dismissive thread and make something useful of it.

I don't think Heavy Metal is a lifestyle, in that it goes against what I do think it stands for. When people that listen to it to gather from it 'a uniform of belonging'... must dress the same, think the same, keep company only of the same people and so on. I think HM is about being an individual and not cowering away from the weaknesses inside you, to address them directly and make them a banner, turn them it into strength. In the word 'lifestyle' I object to the 'style' part.

Heavy Metal is a part of life, for those that are really into it. A state of constant reflection of the juvenile aspect of the psyche. About that curious mixture of naivety and existential ambiguity that intelligent, introvert teenagers struggle with, constantly. Sharp contrasts between animalistic desire and of ethical concerns, higher ontology versus pleasure... I do not know of a single dedicated metalhead that doesn't exhibit this teenager-forever-lost-in-oneself mentality, at least when they open up to you. A lot of people can't deal with looking at that part of themselves (because they have job now and are "grown up") although they still like listening to the music, they feel obligated to make disparaging and distancing remarks about any intellectuality inherent. That's like reading high romantic poetry like William Blake or Coleridge and saying "I hate those... ideals and shit, I just read it because the font is really cool on the page!" Effectively, they're wounding themselves by listening to HM that way, and should probably quit and save themselves the self-loathing.

This modern urge to rail against anything infused with higher meaning or against intellectual pursuits on the whole is a symptom of the consumerist, easy, 'painless' living we are forced into as we grow up and enter the market proper. It's difficult to break out of a pattern of self-abuse (which is what post-modernity dictates) on almost all aspects of daily life. We're made to consume more and more shit and keep quiet and then if we wonder why we're essentially unhappy we're taught that the only person we should hold responsible is ourselves. Buy shit! Hate yourself! Buy more shit! Those that I know and would call real appreciators of HM are trying to break through this consumerist mindset, they're not buying 30 kilos of vinyl every week. They take the records they love and they elevate them from products, to parts of their psyche (just like you'd do with William Blake), they learn from them and the beauty of this music is that if you risk something of yourself, you dedicate even the smallest part of your heart to it, it will return to you a private space in which you are not just another consumer idiot doing what you're born to do but instead, you are what you where before you realized how the world really worked. A teenager. All gawky and disliked by girls and whatever else. But also, strong, proud of your desires (even the embarrassing ones) and willing to shape your own reality on a purer level. That median point between shapes that can only self-define through transgression. Proud to make your own mistakes and not to be defined against, or for, a crooked society from which 'shaping a person' means to shave off every vital edge.
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Post by The Erlking »

Helm wrote: This modern urge to rail against anything infused with higher meaning or against intellectual pursuits on the whole is a symptom of the consumerist, easy, 'painless' living we are forced into as we grow up and enter the market proper.
Sounds very much like passive nihilism to me.

Anyway interesting post and I agree mostly. I've always seen Heavy Metal besides music as a fiery statement for individualism. Nowadays it's maybe even more relevant than in 80s.
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Post by Avenger »

I don't see why Metal is always associated with the teenage years, trying to stay young at heart or the "younger" crowd in general. If we are going to bitch and moan about something being bias, this would be it in my opinion. Sure, back in the 80's, Metal was listened to by predominantly teenagers, but back then it was modern music. If you take a look at the majority of modern music throughout the last 60 years or so it has always been appealing and marketed to the younger generation. What music is trendy today will most likely still be listened to by the teenage generation of now 20 years down the road. I mean, how many of our parents are still into Classic Rock? It's a common cycle.
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Post by hload »

eveytime i'm listening to warlord, i have an urge to pay a visit to the nearby post vyzantine chapel of archangel michael and light a candle....they recently put a fire alarm system there so i don't have to worry if i may get burnt.....
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Post by Helm »

Everyone in this forum was exposed to HM in their teenage years (some younger). The feelings the music attempts to communicate resonate with that, mostly pure, perhaps naive, but open to interpretation and exploratory mindspace, and musicians in this field of all ages usually get into that same frame of mind when they sit to make new HM. It's not 'music for young people', it's music for people that are in touch with their juvenile aspect, for good or worse. What I am trying to communicate has nothing to do with trends, with the 80's in particular, with a 'young crowd', with 'modern music', with 'marketing', or other things you may misunderstand.

Instead of asking leading questions then, perhaps you need to privately think why you even listen to this music if all you can designate about its intrinsics is that it was once a trend in the 80s and that people may stick to the past trends because of nostalgia.
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Post by Black Axe »

Helm wrote:Everyone in this forum was exposed to HM in their teenage years (some younger). The feelings the music attempts to communicate resonate with that, mostly pure, perhaps naive, but open to interpretation and exploratory mindspace, and musicians in this field of all ages usually get into that same frame of mind when they sit to make new HM. It's not 'music for young people', it's music for people that are in touch with their juvenile aspect, for good or worse. What I am trying to communicate has nothing to do with trends, with the 80's in particular, with a 'young crowd', with 'modern music', with 'marketing', or other things you may misunderstand.

Instead of asking leading questions then, perhaps you need to privately think why you even listen to this music if all you can designate about its intrinsics is that it was once a trend in the 80s and that people may stick to the past trends because of nostalgia.
What do you like more, the music or the why
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Post by Avenger »

Helm wrote:Everyone in this forum was exposed to HM in their teenage years (some younger). The feelings the music attempts to communicate resonate with that, mostly pure, perhaps naive, but open to interpretation and exploratory mindspace, and musicians in this field of all ages usually get into that same frame of mind when they sit to make new HM. It's not 'music for young people', it's music for people that are in touch with their juvenile aspect, for good or worse. What I am trying to communicate has nothing to do with trends, with the 80's in particular, with a 'young crowd', with 'modern music', with 'marketing', or other things you may misunderstand.

Instead of asking leading questions then, perhaps you need to privately think why you even listen to this music if all you can designate about its intrinsics is that it was once a trend in the 80s and that people may stick to the past trends because of nostalgia.
There is no misunderstanding at all.

You need to accept that not everyone listens to Metal for the same pseudo intellectual, complex hierarchy reasons that you do. It's been brought up here in the past regarding the same topic that some people just dig Metal for the riffs. That's not entirely my case, as that was an example but just because you may find Metal spiritual, for whatever reasons that you convince yourself of, that's not the case for everybody. You are not the golden standard poster boy for what Metal represents and means for others.

I'm starting to think that opening this topic for sheer comedic purposes was a bad idea because every time something like this pops up it's construed into the same old topic with terrible "beat a dead horse" syndrome.
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Post by Helm »

Black Axe: I like both.
Avenger: I'm not interested in amusing you. When you're prepared to have a real conversation with real people you can attempt again.
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Post by Avenger »

Helm wrote:Black Axe: I like both.
Avenger: I'm not interested in amusing you. When you're prepared to have a real conversation with real people you can attempt again.
What's wrong with my post?

Are you able to have a conversation with someone that does not agree with you?

Quit being ignorant.
bigfootkit wrote:"Your Steel Is Not True"
stormspell wrote:"I hate all my releases. I only listen to Korn and Limp Bizkit, don't you know..."
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Post by Helm »

The problem with your post and general attitude is not that you're disagreeing, it's that you seem incapable or perhaps not making an effort to understand what the other person is trying to say. I told you I don't think HM is spiritual, yet you say
but just because you may find Metal spiritual
Furthermore your posts are riddled with passive agression.
pseudo intellectual
for whatever reasons that you convince yourself of
You are not the golden standard poster boy
Quit being ignorant.
It's not a matter of disagreeing with me, it's a matter of being insulting while you're at it, and very presumptuous. And if that wasn't enough, after people have posted their sincere opinions on a subject that matters to them, you say
opening this topic for sheer comedic purposes
which is degrading to pretty much everybody that posted here. Way to go, quite a comedian. A real conversation with real people presupposes you're willing to give the other person the benefit of the doubt, and you're gonna make an effort to understand what is being told. So, as I said, when you're willing, try again.
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Post by Avenger »

Helm wrote:The problem with your post and general attitude is not that you're disagreeing, it's that you seem incapable or perhaps not making an effort to understand what the other person is trying to say. I told you I don't think HM is spiritual, yet you say
but just because you may find Metal spiritual
Furthermore your posts are riddled with passive agression.
pseudo intellectual
for whatever reasons that you convince yourself of
You are not the golden standard poster boy
Quit being ignorant.
It's not a matter of disagreeing with me, it's a matter of being insulting while you're at it, and very presumptuous. And if that wasn't enough, after people have posted their sincere opinions on a subject that matters to them, you say
opening this topic for sheer comedic purposes
which is degrading to pretty much everybody that posted here. Way to go, quite a comedian. A real conversation with real people presupposes you're willing to give the other person the benefit of the doubt, and you're gonna make an effort to understand what is being told. So, as I said, when you're willing, try again.
Don't be hypocritical. You know just as well as I do that you were placing your opinion above mine when telling me that I had a "misunderstanding" or that I needed to "rethink" my opinion on certain aspects. I'm not going to pick apart every sentence of your post to show how you've done so, as it's clearly obvious. You've also stated that my thread was "dismissive" and "useless" so let's not go about the "I only speak in an intellectual, non-offensive and respectful manner" claim.

Okay, so you've finally come upfront and just plain said "I do not think Metal is spiritual" without rambling on for four pages with no clear outcome. That's pretty much all that was needed. I don’t view Metal message boards for the sake of reading about how Heavy Metal has deeply and emotionally affected the outcome of your existence. I thought that it was quite clear what the purpose of this thread was granted my initial post and the poll options. I really don’t think that it's that difficult to give a quick answer and then poke fun at how far Metal has apparently come in comparison to it's roots. There was no need to hijack the thread and turn it into the usual ten-page banter. Where's your sense of humour?
bigfootkit wrote:"Your Steel Is Not True"
stormspell wrote:"I hate all my releases. I only listen to Korn and Limp Bizkit, don't you know..."
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Post by Helm »

My sense of humour doesn't feed on human flesh.
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