best 80's speed metal band

[mordred]

Rhapsody's debut cd had a sticker saying "symphonic epic Hollywood metal". That's still the best sub genre ever. Impossible to top.

[Helm]

Does that mean that these bands are of this new “sub-genre"?

Well it depends I guess. For you they might not be and for me they might or might not but for them they definitely were, heh. When a band says 'we are a speed metal band!' then I don't really care to argue them out of it, I am just fascinated by their reasoning. Same with you or anyone else, more interested in reasons than changing your minds.

As metal evolved and became a more solidified genre, it also became so varied that sub-genre's were needed.

Actually I'm not so sure. I think mostly, sub-genres stuck because they were useful for marketing. For people that were SELLING the records, not the people that loved the music. I mean as far as I care I could do fine with calling the whole thing, everything 'Heavy Metal' and be done with it. If a band is speedy or it is satanic or whatever else we could discuss without the need of formalized labels.

That being said, now that labels are here and nobody can rip them out of the public consciousness, they are interesting in how people define them!

Today metal has pretty much been pushed as far as it can and this being the case there are now distinguished sub-genres where bands can be correctly placed.

There's still lots of grey area. What are Hammers of Misfortune for example?

Calling Running Wild "Black Metal" today when we are all fully aware what Black Metal really is now is just being ignorant. It's refusing to accept and adapt to modern day advances.

Buh, I have to disagree here. Anyone can call anything whatever they want as long as they have some argument to back it up that seems lucid. I call anything satanic in metal 'black metal', even Deicide, where they're clearly more death metal in terms of music, but my reason is an understandable one. I don't give a shit about modern day advances, I didn't get into this Heavy Metal thing for anybody else's rules

[GJ]

There's still lots of grey area. What are Hammers of Misfortune for example?

Various Metals including Samples of Rock.

[GJ]

As for speed metal I would go for the early speedy yet traditional heavy metal sounds (I doubt that the term traditional would have been used in the early to mid-eighties though) of Raven, Anvil and Accept:

Exciter, Razor (earliest stuff), Warhead, Running Wild, Agent Steel, Crossfire, Iron Angel...

In some ways maybe one could spot the roots of speed metal in songs like, Fireball, Highway Star, Light in the Black, Kill the king, Exciter, Call for the Priest - then adding some Punk, Iron Maiden or Motörhead - whereas Thrash demands some Sabbath Bloody Sabbath, Symtom of the Universe and Megalomaniac plus some Hard Core thrown in too...

[great_knuthulhu]

...
Calling Running Wild "Black Metal" today when we are all fully aware what Black Metal really is now is just being ignorant. It's refusing to accept and adapt to modern day advances.

You mean like accepting that bands like Slipknot, Korn and Cradle of Filth are the epitome of what's metal? Cause that's the result of all our "advances". The term doesn't exist "out there" as in Platonian idealism - it is made up by people to mean what they need it to.

Not that I'd want to call Running Wild Black Metal, but not all changes to genre definitions should be accepted just because they're new. Doing that would just be ignorance.

[metalmaster]

Calling Running Wild "Black Metal" today when we are all fully aware what Black Metal really is now is just being ignorant. It's refusing to accept and adapt to modern day advances.

Sorry but I would rather call Black Metal the first and even the second album of Running Wild than all those shitty bands ripoffing Bathory endlessly. Running wild had the satanic and revolting lyrics, much more mature than those crap bands hailing genocide, detruction, etc. It seems newer generations havent learnt nothing and go backwards to the extreme of ridiculous. And still they deny Venom as Black Metal!

[Avenger]

Actually I'm not so sure. I think mostly, sub-genres stuck because they were useful for marketing. For people that were SELLING the records, not the people that loved the music. I mean as far as I care I could do fine with calling the whole thing, everything 'Heavy Metal' and be done with it. If a band is speedy or it is satanic or whatever else we could discuss without the need of formalized labels.

That being said, now that labels are here and nobody can rip them out of the public consciousness, they are interesting in how people define them.

Where do you draw the line in regards to what's metal and not then?

With sub-genre's it's way more streamlined...

There's still lots of grey area. What are Hammers of Misfortune for example?

I wouldn’t know, I've never heard nor have the interest to listen to this band. It's too modern for me.

Buh, I have to disagree here. Anyone can call anything whatever they want as long as they have some argument to back it up that seems lucid. I call anything satanic in metal 'black metal', even Deicide, where they're clearly more death metal in terms of music, but my reason is an understandable one. I don't give a shit about modern day advances, I didn't get into this Heavy Metal thing for anybody else's rules

This is a contradiction on your behalf based on your previous posts on what you consider "metal heads rules to abide by".

Aside from that, sub-genres shouldn't be/aren't defined by lyrics, which is the only real way of determining a band to be "satanic”. Also, by this reasoning alone if a band like Poison, (the shitty glam one from L.A.) had satanic lyrics in their music, does that mean that they are "Black Metal"?

I think this is rather odd and construed logic...

[Avenger]

Calling Running Wild "Black Metal" today when we are all fully aware what Black Metal really is now is just being ignorant. It's refusing to accept and adapt to modern day advances.

Sorry but I would rather call Black Metal the first and even the second album of Running Wild than all those shitty bands ripoffing Bathory endlessly. Running wild had the satanic and revolting lyrics, much more mature than those crap bands hailing genocide, detruction, etc. It seems newer generations havent learnt nothing and go backwards to the extreme of ridiculous. And still they deny Venom as Black Metal!

See my reply to Helm.

[Avenger]

...
Calling Running Wild "Black Metal" today when we are all fully aware what Black Metal really is now is just being ignorant. It's refusing to accept and adapt to modern day advances.

You mean like accepting that bands like Slipknot, Korn and Cradle of Filth are the epitome of what's metal? Cause that's the result of all our "advances". The term doesn't exist "out there" as in Platonian idealism - it is made up by people to mean what they need it to.

Not that I'd want to call Running Wild Black Metal, but not all changes to genre definitions should be accepted just because they're new. Doing that would just be ignorance.

Not at all, I'm talking modern day sub-genre classification to define REAL METAL bands of the 80's.

I thought this was apparent being that this forum really has very little to do with these bands labelled as "Metal" by emo kids.

[Helm]

Where do you draw the line in regards to what's metal and not then?

If it has the very bare essential and basic musical rudiments of Heavy Metal, and it also has a passionate execution, an underlying vision and is honest, it is Heavy fuckin' Metal.

With sub-genre's it's way more streamlined...

Sure... but why is that a good thing? I'd much rather have someone explain to me why they love Mercyful Fate in 300 words than in 5. Streamlining is good for commerce, but detail is good for human interaction. I am not interested in the commerce side of things much anymore. I am not 15 and going through Hellion catalogues picking everything up that says 'technical' and 'thrash' (or 'epic' and 'doom metal'!) in the 10 word description.

I wouldn’t know, I've never heard nor have the interest to listen to this band. It's too modern for me.

Hah how do you know they're modern-sounding without having heard them. There's nothing 'modern' about Hammers of Misfortune. They slay. You're missing out

This is a contradiction on your behalf based on your previous posts on what you consider "metal heads rules to abide by".

Not at all as long as you keep in mind that these rules are my rules and they apply to myself and nobody else. I have no hardon for defining other peoples' reality, just mine. I say my part and expect others to say theirs so that some sort of communication occurs.

Aside from that, sub-genres shouldn't be/aren't defined by lyrics, which is the only real way of determining a band to be "satanic”. Also, by this reasoning alone if a band like Poison, (the shitty glam one from L.A.) had satanic lyrics in their music, does that mean that they are "Black Metal"?

Yes, if Poison had satanic lyrics (real, honest, convincing) they'd be black metal for me! Lyrics and aesthetics play a big part for me in HM. Another example: often the only difference between black metal and pagan metal is the subject matter. Primordial are not a black metal band, yet they 'sound' like one once in a while. Again if you don't know Primordial, I heartily recommend them!

I think this is rather odd and construed logic...

Odd sure... any construsion going on though you'd have to take responsibility for. I'm quite clear in what I say.

[Avenger]

Hah how do you know they're modern-sounding without having heard them. There's nothing 'modern' about Hammers of Misfortune. They slay. You're missing out

I didn't say "modern sounding", now you are assuming things. I said "modern" as in they are a modern day band. I told you that I've never heard them.

We're getting way off topic here...

[Helm]

I'm sorry for misunderstanding you. So you won't listen to anything modern on the fact that it is modern to begin with?

[GJ]

They slay. You're missing out

Agreed, most definitely! But if you can do all this magic in mere five (or six) words and a smiley, I'm eager to reading the three hundred words version.

[Avenger]

I'm sorry for misunderstanding you. So you won't listen to anything modern on the fact that it is modern to begin with?

I'm not saying that I won't, I'm saying that with my already lengthy "to listen to list" of bands from the glory days, I simply don't have mucn time nor interest in modern bands.

[Helm]

That's fair enough, certainly. Hammers of Misfortune come with my highest recommendation as 'Heavy Metal for the ages' in any case. Not flavour of the month, excellent, timeless perfect metal.