Non-urgent CD Inquiries READ THE FIRST POST

Helstar · Post by **Helstar** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 8:57 pm

Some infos I found by case: there are two different pressings of the Torchure debut (red logo/white cd - green logo/red cd, this one comes first) and Miasma full lenght (normal/pictured cd - apparently, both versions have blank spines without infos !)

http://helstar.altervista.org/torchure.jpg

Vampallens · Post by **Vampallens** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 9:47 pm

I have Miasma pictured cd with blank spine, but seriously no idea which version come first.

Happy to know to have Torchure first pressing, thanx H.

Fabeldyr · Post by **Fabeldyr** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 3:16 pm

I would consider the Miasma blank cd with logo as the first one. It has and old logo for the Lethal Records label (not featured on any other Lethal releases as far as I know) + that one was probably only distributed by Lethal Records at first - then later released proberly by Lethal Records.

Osmi_Putnik · Post by **Osmi_Putnik** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:38 pm

I need little help, to be clear with this:
What is the matrix of 1st press Heir Apparent - Graceful Inheritance from 1986?
Is this correct?
1986: http://www.musik-sammler.de/media/265626
What is this statement: "Innerer Innenring MPO France 08 Compact Disc"

1996: http://www.musik-sammler.de/media/4200

Chebanana's listing (says 1986):
http://www.ebay.com/itm/HEIR-APPARENT-G ... 53f12d6c9e

Thanks!

Heathen · Post by **Heathen** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:49 pm

the so-called later press can't be from 1996. it would have IFPI (SID) codes.

Did anyone actually see/has the "MPO France 08 Compact Disc" pressing?

Warepire · Post by **Warepire** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 7:59 pm

Heathen wrote:the so-called later press can't be from 1996. it would have IFPI (SID) codes.

Did anyone actually see/has the "MPO France 08 Compact Disc" pressing?

Just because SID codes were introduced in 1994 doesn't mean every plant started using them. There are legit plants today that still don't have SID codes.

Heathen · Post by **Heathen** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:12 pm

it is very rare to find a CD from 1996 without an ifpi code especially from a well known plant. And i know that MPO DID use IFPI in mid-late 90-ties as many other CDs prove. Noise catalogue reissues are an example.

anyway, I will attack from the other flank - do you know any good reason why the CD is thought to be from 1996? I don't.

Osmi_Putnik · Post by **Osmi_Putnik** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:19 pm

Maybe 2nd press isn't from 1996, rather from 1993 like, let's say Exxplorer?

Heathen · Post by **Heathen** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:23 pm

More likely. The matrix style is similar to the one used for Under One Flag releases, and we all know their timeframe. Late 90s MPO matrices looked a bit differently and had IFPI, example: http://s.pixogs.com/image/R-4114261-135 ... -8671.jpeg

The 1996 release date is something someone once put on Musik Sammler and everyone seems to just repeat it without giving it any thought.

Plus I am not sure the an earlier CD pressing exists, havent's seen it. Maybe it does, maybe not. Would be glad to see a proof.

Osmi_Putnik · Post by **Osmi_Putnik** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:31 pm

Heathen wrote:More likely. The matrix style is similar to the one used for Under One Flag releases, and we all know their timeframe. Late 90s MPO matrices looked a bit differently and had IFPI, example: http://s.pixogs.com/image/R-4114261-135 ... -8671.jpeg

The 1996 release date is something someone once put on Musik Sammler and everyone seems to just repeat it without giving it any thought.

Savage Grace both albums are from 1996, they have IFPI codes
One example:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SAVAGE-GRACE-Af ... 53eb59570e

So there was 1993 and 1996 Black Dragon rereleases, but what's with that '86 press of Heir Apparent?

Warepire · Post by **Warepire** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:34 pm

Heathen wrote:it is very rare to find a CD from 1996 without an ifpi code especially from a well known plant. And i know that MPO DID use IFPI in mid-late 90-ties as many other CDs prove. Noise catalogue reissues are an example.

anyway, I will attack from the other flank - do you know any good reason why the CD is thought to be from 1996? I don't.

The Noise CDs are as far as I know still getting reprinted every now and then. At least some of them. I have some made in the UK, some in France etc. There are no clear years for any of these reprints so using them as "proof" is not going to persuade me to change my view on the matter.

Now I have to admit that I am not expert on the Black Dragon catalog but as far as I know pretty much every album in that catalog was pressed on CD in 1996, I know some albums have earlier CD presses as well, but in my understanding this Heir Apparent CD has the same "layout" as the CDs that have 1996 written on them.

Though I must agree that the Heir Apparent CD looks more like my Krixhjälters CD (pressed 1989) than my My-Lai CD (pressed ~1994).

Heathen · Post by **Heathen** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:38 pm

Warepire wrote:using them as "proof" is not going to persuade me to change my view on the matter.

Maybe the Savage Grace scan from above will. Black Dragon 1996. Has IFPI. Arguing that a post 1994 CD from a big plant does not have IFPI number is an incredebily long shot.

1995 with ifpi:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SAVAGE-GRACE-Ma ... 53eb4e967b

and here is one looking lige that Heir Apparent:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/DRUID-Vampire-c ... 53ea51a363

Warepire · Post by **Warepire** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:48 pm

Heathen wrote:
Warepire wrote:using them as "proof" is not going to persuade me to change my view on the matter.
Maybe the Savage Grace scan from above will. Black Dragon 1996. Has IFPI. Arguing that a post 1994 CD from a big plant does not have IFPI number is an incredebily long shot.

I just saw that, also I realized that after ~1994 it's a lot more common that they also engrave the number of the run into the disc than before (last numbers in the matrix that have a different color in the photo), I have the same thing on my My-Lai CD. Also the Savage Grace CD has a colored logo while the Heir Apparent one has a plain black.

All this suggests that the Heir Apparent CD was made before the My-Lai CD, this means we can with satisfactory certainty date it to pre-1994.

Heathen · Post by **Heathen** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 8:53 pm

seems reasonable. if I were to shoot a date I'd say 1990-1991... I was looking at some scans from chebanana and there is another MPO/Black Dragon matrix variation without ifpi that looks a later press then Heir Apparent/Druid:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/METAL-WITHOUT-M ... 53ee38f983
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ST-ELMOS-FIRE-D ... 53ed9efa79

That would fill the 1992-1994 timeframe. Just a hypothesis, though.

Osmi_Putnik · Post by **Osmi_Putnik** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 9:04 pm

So, let me sum this, what i have seen here about MPO plant:
- From ...198? until 1992 matrix has that thinny circle above matrix number
- They change matrix area from, let's say 1993
- And than, of course started to implement IFPI ('94)

If i'm wrong, just correct me